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Every step I take, I move my truth. Every time they tell me stop by you there, become a hate that makes my together up my energy. I'm boom, I heard them talking saying, the way that I'm moving, so reckless. That is a part of my mind. I've been blessed with giving my blood to Miami.
This is the keep a collective. I'm here with dr. Rhonda, Patrick, man, I'm so excited that you're here. I can't believe you're here, actually.
I'm, it's been so fun, like, the day yesterday doing the archery Lutheran issue, the left run, shoot. Yeah. And and the run, the hill hike doing it in like the hot part of the day. That was that was, it was intense, but awesome and then coming back and lifting weights like heavier than I've ever
done. We're
My goal is to make a memory well, two things make it memorable and push people beyond what they've normally done. That's I just like I like seeing people out of their quote comfort zone because I think people they get used to doing a certain thing that you two acting a certain way and people are used to that. But when everybody changes a little bit when you're like in this new space where even if it's activity or could be cognitive, but you're in this new area that you're not.
Typically in it's like it kind of pulled back the curtain and I love doing that. I love seeing what makes people take and what they're capable of and you like were awesome
yesterday. Well that's where it happens, you know. Like when you like you said when you kind of push past that and it's amazing how like if I if I am traveling or something you know with my family or work routine, something takes me out of like just even like we're talking about this being sedentary. Like if you can't like if I
Can't do my normal like exercise stuff and then all of a sudden I'm in this other routine and it's like, it feels like I've been doing it forever, even though it's only been, you know, like three or four days and I'm like, I feel like I've been a sedentary person for my whole life, right? And so it's like, if you don't keep pushing like you can get comfortable. Yes quick. Yeah, right. Like quick, I mean, least I can maybe not, you
know, I get it if I miss a day me and my boys, we talked about, you know, we feel skinny fat so that's like the
The worst thing is to be skinny arms fast. Um, yeah. So one day after doing it, you could do it for years and it seems like in one day you're like it's all gone in your head anyway and you're like, oh God, I'm you know I'm skinny-fat now but it's a
that's the worst kind of fat so that you said fat around your stomach, it's a visceral fat and that's actually a type of fat that it's kind of deeper to and it's surrounds your organs and it's
Then there's like subcutaneous fat you know us girls have but I mean it's it's it's very much Associated again with cancer risk. I didn't creases like cytokines and that and stuff, pro-inflammatory. Cytokines that are had that have been linked to cancer. So that visceral fat and heart disease and, you know, metabolic dysfunction is the worst kind,
why is it that like? Well it seems like it's a little bit different for men and women but guys get that around their stomach first, you know, like the love
Idols type thing. And then women might get back of the arms. Back, the legs. What, what, determines, where that fat, why are we getting gaining fat there?
I don't know the answer to that. I'm sure someone does. I mean, there's definitely women get it, like, post-menopause there, right? So there's there's, there's got to be a hormonal thing going on, but it's a good
question. You see guys like with, you know, their legs could have no fat on them, super skinny their arms.
Whatever, but it's didn't the stomach. Yeah, and that's obviously, that's, that's the bad part is, it's not only nobody likes how it looks, but as you said, like, increases cancer risk and everything else. But yeah. So yesterday it was cool because you said, you do you lift weights with your dumbbells, 8 pounds,
right? I do, I usually do eight pounds. I got like a Peloton guided work out and I do because I've always been an endurance junkie and
Like you. But like, yeah, you know, like I've it's running jumping rope, you know, that's those are sort of my jam, right? Yeah, surfing. But the lifting weights, I really, it's, I got really into it. And the last, I would say, since last summer, in particular,
your arms, you are a
hard time getting some time, right? Like yeah. No. I mean it's and of course, that's reinforcing right. That's
yeah. You see results. You want to work
harder? Yeah, exactly. But, you know,
Being into the science of muscle mass. Hmm, was really what convinced me, and there's two major signals for muscle mass protein intake, amino acids and mechanical work or forces, right? Right? So both of those two things stimulate muscle protein synthesis. So, that is happening in skeletal muscle, right? And both of those things, I really hadn't focused a lot on in the
past,
And we're in control of both those a lot of people talk about things that are out of their control, you know? But we can, we control how much protein we eat? How much resistance were putting our body writer, we
do? And it's, you know, the, the people aren't. So let's talk about protein intake. Yeah. Because the art. So there's the RDA, for protein intake. And this had me, this was like, oh,
yeah, and the daily allowance. Yeah,
0.8 grams per kilogram body weight. I think that's something like, 0.32 grams.
Pound. Okay. Something like that. Yeah. But, you know, for the longest time it was like, oh, I think that's, you know, that's the that's the RDA and, and it wasn't until I had Stuart Phillips on dr. Stuart Phillips, who's an amazing, you know, research scientist. He, he's very well respected in like the bodybuilding Community, but also in the scientific community. And he has done studies as well as like others where they're actually looked, it's their Tracer studies. So so
Protein unlike fat or unlike, you know, carbohydrates which form glucose. You can store glucose, right? Glycogen in your muscle or whatever you can store fatty acids, right? Like those go triglycerides was get stored and adipose tissue like that there's energy Reserve you could you can have that stored protein you have to replace like amino acids. Well, your muscle does serve as a reservoir for it but you don't want to pull from that because then your catabolic right like so that's not
All right, where's you want to pull? You want to get the you know, the fat storage, yes. So you have to replace those amino acids and you need like protein to. I mean, protein is like building everything. Everything in your body is run by proteins, which are made up of amino acids, you need to replace them. So, it's important to take to take in the protein. So, anyways, there's there's Tracer studies that were done where the scientist at the time. We're trying to figure out, okay, well, how much
Protein, do humans, do we my on average need to take in to prove, you know, to prevent to replace the losses. Basically how much you lose each day. And so it was like these nitrogen balance studies, right? And there was lots of flaws in those studies apparently like the technology that was used the methods, it's all about the sensitivity of your assay and what method you're doing. Right. And so there were they were basically under estimating losses of of the nitrogen and and so like new
These have come out and again not just from Stu Phillips but like others where it's more like one point two grams per kilogram body weight. A day is the minimum till they cannot be catabolic. That's not, that's not the optimum for muscle hypertrophy, right? But just not peeing.
Catabolic bodybuilder, say get Big E big.
So yeah. I mean and then those Studies have been done where it's like well you know, if you start going up to like 1 point 6 to point,
Two grams per kilogram body weight, then you're in, you know, particularly in combination with resistance training. So, you know how much protein you need depends on a lot of factors right here, your age 41. So age is important because as we get older, like 65 year olds, you know, and older your body isn't as sensitive to amino acid. So muscle protein synthesis isn't stimulated as much as when you're younger so at least at a higher dose. So so you need to take in more
And it needs to be spread throughout the
day you're talking about when you're over 65. Okay, yeah,
well even, you know, even there's been studies in younger people looking at lets you know, like so for taking four meals of 20 grams of protein, each versus two meals of 40 grams of protein each and the four of the twenty grams of protein, each was better at stimulating muscle protein synthesis and young healthy like trained men. Yeah. And again, that's also just
Because and it's not like, okay. Well if you only do two, I mean obviously you're in a taken more, but it does seem that more frequency is better. Now, most people just kind of aim for the day because at a certain point like you gotta just like do something right? I guess. How much am I getting this day? Like that's the most important for most people but I but I think like the like I'm now trying to spread it out more. Hmm. We're like when I first wake up. It's, you know that's when you're the most catabolic, you've been fasting all night need to replace that.
Team. And so like, if people are doing a longer fast they have to be doing resistance training and if you're not resistance training, they're losing their losing muscle, right? Like and that's something that's was sort of eye-opening for me as well. Where's like some of these people that are losing weight now? Not like super obese? People like they have a lot of fat to lose. Yeah. But like, lets, you know, say just maybe a little bit overweight, if they're not resistance training and their calorically restricting right there. They're eating fewer calories.
Violating their dieting 30% of that weight loss can come from muscle. Yeah. Yeah. Unless your resistance training you can really, you can damper that a
lot. So even if you weren't getting enough protein and you were calorie restricted but you were resistance training your better way better off. Okay. Way better off. Yeah. Like you're like not ideal but still just the lifting the
weight lifting the weight stimulates muscle protein synthesis. Yeah. And those two together of course our that's that's the secret sauce, right? And that's
But like muscle mass is so important and it wasn't thinking about how important was like, for, you know, mortality, you know, basically you want to you want to have more of that muscle mass because it decreases your frail to risk, your risk of Falls, your I mean, it's there's so many things where it's like and you start to become like you atrophy happens at a lot faster rate, right? Once you hit a certain age right harder to gain muscle, what mean
yeah. What I've tried to do and we
Did the math yesterday because you're in kilograms. And, you know, I'm not smart enough to figure it out, but just a rule of thumb for me, has always been a gram of protein for pound of body weight. So if I'm 170, I want to get 170 grams of protein in and we did the math. And it's like, what you were talking about is way low the rdas way low, but what the studies in the from the doctor you mentioned is more in line with the gram per pound. Right? Yeah.
So not having so, so like I think it was like 0.32.
Grams per pound is what the RDA
is, right? And so, a third of what I would
do and I imagine like, people that are athletes or do you know, exercising, maybe not even necessarily an athlete, but like, a really like the exercise a lot. Yeah. You're you need more protein to like repair muscle like you, you know,
that's really way too many carbs not nearly enough protein and I felt like the first, the first meal of the day is the key because you've been catabolic. You said, so that's where a lot of people have oatmeal and
toast.
Yeah. It's like the biggest carb heavy meal morning when it should be protein. Yeah. Protein is like, the first thing that you should eat. And, you know, it's I I now, I like, I've always liked egg. So, like eggs have always been my go-to for breakfast. But like now it's it's really like, I feel like it's so important. And again, like skipping breakfast has become this thing, and I'm partly responsible that not because I told people to skip breakfast. But because talking
About, like internment intermittent, fasting and time restricted eating when you're eating within a Time window, mmm. So that you're having a period of repair, like you're, you know, like when you're sleeping, you know, things are repairing that's a repair process and just like, when you sleep your brain shuts down, right? You're not like, you're not thinking about things. That's when your brain is repairing. If you were, if you were awake and thinking an active, the repairs not happening, right? Was that's part of what why sleep is so important, right? Well, the same goes for digestion, like if you're not, if that stuff is moving and your
And all that like repair isn't happening, right? That's not the repair
State, you know, there's some hardcore bodybuilders that will wake up the middle of the night and eat. Wow, to get to get the protein. This is in which hoary to drink a protein drink like at 2:00 in the morning. What do you think that's do? Because it's always like to gain muscle. You have to just eat like eating is almost as hard as training sometimes if you're saying, I need to get some of the guys, 300 grams of protein.
That is an effort. That's its and to do it. They'll do what? Middle of the night stuff. So, what is, what is that doing? Do you think
so? Okay, nuanced topic. I am not the expert. I have talked to the experts
about pretty strong yesterday,
I've had two of them on my podcast. Brad schoenfeld, Stuart Phillips. Highly respected bodybuilding Community respects them. Scientists respect them. Right? So from my understanding after talking to these having these guys in my podcast and talking to them and just
Going over their data. Like just interested, I'm interested in my own, I'm like, I've got to do this, I've got to do this, it's my understanding that generally speaking. Like obviously the most important is the daily parenting, right? So it used to be like oh, you work out, then you have to take the protein right then? And is that like required? No. But I do think that because the half-life of protein is like 3 to 5 hours. And if you're working out, you're using it, it makes sense.
Sense to do it like right at like more frequently like right after the
says lift and they say they like will drink a protein drink during because they say this is the best time to shuttle that protein into muscle. Yeah. Does that make any silic? This is
well I mean if you're increasing like leucine transporter expression which is very possible that that that resistance training does that because the body adapts, right? And part of the way it adapts is by, you know, doing things that are going to give.
More amino acids. So it would make sense that that you know, could I haven't looked at that specific thing, gross science. But I mean, you know yeah some of the so. So there's been meta-analysis that are this is like big analyses of multiple studies looking at this whole protein timing thing right and the, you know, take home on that was know. The timings not as important as we thought it was just get the protein for the day, right?
Caveat though, caveat, right? Can you squeeze a little bit more drops out of the wet cloth. If you are, you know, doing it right after probably, probably just knowing that that, you know, the half-life of the protein and knowing that you're more responsive, also, like if you're doing it more frequently. So they've probably noticed it, they probably noticed it affect their their muscles or muscle growth by doing more frequent meals. And so that's why they do
And as we talked about that placebo effect, we mentioned like the, the house Keepers Study last night, I read it to you but it might be the guys thinking this is helping so then their training may be a little harder, you know, the push a little harder, a little harder. Yes. For sure. You think it's giving you a little Edge because you're taking a protein in. So I'm just going to do a few more those reps where it's like, you would have done otherwise and those are the ones at the end and so you're getting bigger
because you're motivated. Yeah, I mean motivation all that stuff makes a makes a big difference.
And and so yeah, so the two, the two things doing that or the protein and the mechanical stimulation. And so if people are doing, I think we're going back to the like the the skipping breakfast where it became like, somehow easier for people to just skip breakfast. And that's how they extended their fasting period. Yeah. For some reason it's like right. Well, maybe you can just shift breakfast over a little bit, so still eat the same amount of meals, right? You're still getting the protein because if you skip an entire meal, like you're skipping a lot of
Our team, right? Yeah. And that's where it's like, oh that's a problem. And then if you're not resistant, training on top of that, another happens studies on time restricted eating, which is a type of intermittent fasting. Yeah. If at least in women, if they resistant, strain, they're not losing muscle so. But you know, the, the skipping the meal is, I think the the problem where you know, it's just that became a thing where it's like, yeah, I only two meals a day and yeah, how are you getting enough protein between meals a day and
And are you saturating it to a point where it's like your muscles only going to take up so much and then the rest you're just using as energy, right?
So yeah, I'll how I do it and I don't know. You can tell me if this makes sense. I pretty much eat I would say almost every hour of the day not a lot but I'm eating all the time all the time because I feel like I can tell if I'm going to go on a run and in my head I'm thinking do I need to hydrate and I need to get fuel in
In. I want my cells to be full like before I do a like an endurance race or hunt. I'm pounding calories of fluids because I have my, I want my, all my cells. And then my, in my head I'm thinking my body is just full of cells. I want them full and fueled, so I do that then I go do the whatever I'm doing the training, and then I'm just back to eating non-stop. What about your magnesium? Do you take that morning? You take the morning. I think, at night, know that,
Take some at night to 4 because I think it helps sleeping, doesn't it?
Yeah. I mean it for some people a lot of pills. Yeah, lot of supplements. Well, the reason I
asked-- puts it together
so that's nice. I do that for my husband to. You got to you got to take care of the people, you love,
right. I know, I know, usually she's saying I need to take a day off and don't run so far. So she's like, trying to screw me over. Normally trying to make me. Weak is how I might? Yeah, you turn it. Bring me down, aren't
you? She knows that's what motivates you. I'll show you.
I'm going.
I think she actually just cares and I hate when people care about me. So, I'm like, trying to push him away,
trying to make me weak. So the Magnesium is for endurance athletes. It's good, that you take it, but it's like a problem because already like a baseline, most people in the US are not getting enough magnesium. So, the RDA for that is like three 20 milligrams for women for 24
men, where they get magnesium back in the day before there was a
green. So, so magnesium is that
The center of a chlorophyll molecule of chlorophyll, give plants their green color, okay? So plants green plants are really high in magnesium. Right, buddy. It's green plants. No. Nobody eats them not in the US. No, King. I mean, I don't, is there anything green on the menu? A Burger King,
I like green Jello
this gelatin, but yeah, so greens almonds are high in it nuts to, but so that's, that's the major dietary source of magnesium supplementing also becomes
Important, particularly for people that are Physically Active. Because so half the country almost 45 to 50 percent of the u.s. population. Doesn't meet that requirement women in particular don't, but you, you, you lose magnesium and sweat and you lose it in urine. Hmm. And so people that are sweating, if they're Physically Active, using the sauna endurance training, they're losing a lot of magnesium and so athletes can require between 10 to 20 percent more than
The RDA depending on their, their physical activity. Yeah. And so if you're starting with someone and why is that important? Because for performance, I mean, it's important for a lot of things like including cancer because all your enzymes that repair DNA damage. So that's the stuff that causes mutation, you probably think about it more like smoking causes it UV radiation causes it, but just normal life causes it, living like metabolism, cause just eating food like, yeah, you know, so, but we have yet living, we have enzymes that repair that damage.
They need magnesium to function. So again, one of those things where, oh, you're not getting magnesium for the, you know, 10, 20, 30 years, you're always not getting enough. Where's the Magnesium going to go? Is it going to go to these DNA, repair enzymes to prevent cancer? Which your body doesn't care about could that doesn't hit until what fifth sixth seventh decade of life or is it going to go to making energy? Which is, you need to survive in now? Yeah, because magnesium is essential to make and to utilize use it and to make it
ATP. It's the form of energy that's made in mitochondria inside of ourselves that we need to live. So it's one of those things where even you may not be getting enough for that as well. But on top of that, it's required to make heme, which is a component of hemoglobin, which transports oxygen from your lungs and takes it to your muscles when you're
exercising. So like for endurance for
endurance and so I think and again I'm just, you know, knowing that half the
Tree is not getting enough. Magnesium know, maybe endurance athletes are the ones that know about it. Maybe they're not. Yeah, baby. And not only that. They have, they're supposed to be getting ten to twenty percent more than the
RDA. Yeah, I've never heard
that. No, it's no one talks about it right now. In talks about these, These are micronutrients, right? These are essential vitamins minerals, we have to get from our diet, so magnesium's and mineral, but it's not like this isn't something. I mean, people always think of this stuff like they want to see, you know, that they're not getting
getting scurvy or something on the gums, right? No, this is like stuff. You can't see right system. Now with performance, you might notice the effect because your performance but might change most
people don't notice, you know, an elite athlete would notice one percent increase. Yeah, a regular person just going out for a 3-mile run, they're not going to notice those a small incremental benefit, you know. I mean you might feel better one day and like oh I'm better than good. But yes really
To notice that, that small percentage. But if you do, and it's like, you're putting all the to me, I just keep hearing about all these little things. You can do that make big differences. You know, magnesium is one. We've talked about a lot of different things recessions training, but if you're doing all that holy cow, right? You can change your life
to do everything, right? You try to do everything that you can. And then the supplementing with it, like there's those people can supplement with magnesium. There's lots of forms of it. There's electrolytes. I take the electrolyte, you know, which has magnesium in Italy.
Actually drink elements is what I take. Yeah, there's a ton of them out there,
right? I think mountaintops actually has 12 that I Mountain opposite actually take. Yeah. But yeah, that's I mean magnesium. I know it's a, it's important. I wonder how about grizzly me. You think that's good for you? You had Grizzly
meet. I did. It was definitely tasty. I mean so that kind of brings us to the omega-3 world. Oh yeah. I mean I don't I would be
interested, think study. And did you just did right or know about?
Well, yeah. I'm
I've so there's lots of Omega-3 research going on. I'm now in a, an associate research associate at the fatty acid Research Institute, which is it's a non-profit, but they do a lot of fatty acid, research, mostly omega-3. Okay? So yeah, I'm involved in a couple of studies there but the, the founder of that built dr. Bill Harris. He's amazing. I've had him on the podcast. He's really, he's been doing. Oh my gosh, I mean, he was like, one of the Pioneers in this, this research field and he's developed something called
Add the omega-3 index test, which is a more accurate long-term marker of Omega-3. So you measure omega-3 in red, blood cells which stay around for about a hundred and twenty one days. So it's like a long-term marker versus measuring it in your plasma phospholipids, which is, like, what did you have for dinner? A couple of days ago. Was that fishing in? Okay, read that. So, it's one of those things where it's like a little more reliable, again, back to the tools that were using to measure things. All that stuff matters,
right? I'm excited.
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the omega-3 index. He's been, I mean he's just published one phenomenal study after another using the omega-3 index and a large large cohorts of people and has found that a higher Omega-3.
Index. So this would be like eight percent, which is not what's in the u.s. So the average omega-3 index in the u.s. is like less than
5%
5% of, you know, the fatty acids being omega-3
in this is this the same as just fish oil. Like you
remember, back to the mega three. Yes. So eating fish or taking supplementing with fish oil which is you can get a lot of Omega-3s from doing that right versus that, you know, both are good.
Because that also there's other nutrients and fish as well and there's protein, but yes, it is so people. So we can get to that which is like, how do you go from a 4%? Write Omega 3 and x 28 percent. Well, those Studies have been done and it takes about on average, two grams of Omega-3 a day, supplementation, to go from 4% to 8%. Now that's two grams less than what's being prescribed by doctors Physicians prescribe Omega Pharmaceutical.
Omega-3, it's called either vicita or Lovaza and they prescribe it for high triglycerides. So my mom takes it
like, high blood pressure.
I don't know if it's prescribed for high blood pressure, but it's definitely for high triglyceride
triglyceride. And what's that is a man's
terms like high triglycerides? Yeah. So that's when you're that's like, you know, the it's a glycerol backbone with Three fatty acids. So that's how we store fat when that's like circulating in your body, it's bad. Okay. I gets a cardiovascular disease risk factor, oh I see.
Like blood pressure is the way we should talk about the have a story. Oh, come. But, anyways, the thing that's amazing with the omega-3 indexes that people that have, the eight percent omega-3 index are have a five year, increased life expectancy compared to people that have wow, 4% by five
year, think about five years of being around your loved ones, doing amazing things, enjoying Live 5
years and their studies showing that they're like, you're much less likely to get Alzheimer's disease. If you have a high,
I Omega 3 and X. So the quality of life is better as well. And I was telling you this yesterday I like talking because it blows my mind every time. Yeah, the smoke. So they took this cohort of people and they were smokers in there are smokers and there's non-smokers and they looked at their omega-3 index and they found that the smokers that had a high omega-3 index of eight percent. So these are smokers are like I need the fish oil I got to do some smoke and you know, is that they had the same life expectancy as the
Smokers with the low, Mega three
index. That is insane that you could be somebody who's running every day, but not get enough fish oil. Then somebody who's you know, smoking a pack of Marlboros and taking fish oil and you're going to have the same amount.
Roughly I mean of course there's probably other things at play as well.
But yeah, I mean theoretically
Omega-3s are so important. I think that they are hugely important for the brain for inflammation and then for muscle. And this was like a big thing too because it's a really sort of
Of growing field. There's a few people, doing this research, one of them to talk to Chris mcclory. I think I told you about them and he's kind of a June, a junior researcher. So he's kind of just started his lab. He trained with Stu Phillips. I had them on the podcast, like, you know, like a month ago or so. And he was blowing my mind with some of his data and look, there's, there's got to be more, you know, larger studies done. This stuff has to be replicated. Other people have replicated his work as well, but like, you know, there's you always need more evidence.
That caveat Omega-3s are protecting against disuse atrophy. So so you know I mean there's he's now done a few studies him and others where high-dose omega-3 so that we're talking 425 grams a day.
Like what's up hill? When you take a supplement you take a pill. How much is
that? It depends on the supplement. So a good one, you're going to get like 500 mg of, you know, let's say 350 of its DHA.
Say and then 150 of its, you know, EPA which are the two Marine forms a LA's the platform really, not doesn't do now. If we're talking about the, the Marine forms, right? So, I like there's a really good fish oil. Brand called, it's metagenic sand, they make something called Oma Genex and it's a, it's a liquid, and you do like one teaspoon of that, and that already gets you like above two grams so doing like,
Two teaspoons, like one in the morning, one in the evening may
never get him that eight percentage, you're talking about her. Is that above that? Even
though if you do if you do, if you are doing more like for G, that would be above that. Okay? But yeah, two grams would get you. So why like I personally do take like experimentally high doses of Omega-3 but not so much higher than again. People are being prescribed for
Castle, you know. As with me I'm like if a little is good, a lot better on everything so be careful when you say, well that's the one thing bottle that way.
Yeah. The, what's the one thing though that I like, you know, it I can't find evidence that too much omega-3 is really now. I guess some people, it might have might affect arrhythmia, but it decreases stroke risk. So in people with cardiovascular risk factors, there's like some little sort of growing evidence. We don't quite understand. It more needs to be done that they you know they're getting some people do get arrhythmia. But again, the stroke risk is lowered from
And that's like undeniable. So that's the whole problem with arrhythmias, that increases stroke risk. So you're kind of like, well, you know, it's one of those things we don't understand right? But it should be investigated more.
Yeah, yeah. I got that
researchers don't understand. I mean it's not that I don't understand is that science hasn't figured it out yet. I guess that that's what I should say. Yeah, so with the omega-3 in the disuse, atrophy had. So it's really interesting because you were asking about
About like, you know, you're talking about like in like increasing the amino acids and in the muscle like transport or something and the Omega-3s are sensitizing muscle to amino acids and other words, they're, they're taking amino acids and make making a smaller protein dose seem bigger to muscles,
which does it seem like this could be? I mean, it seems so powerful is this like, the want is you can do one thing.
Singing should this be it? It seems crazy how powerful this it is. Yeah this is
why I joined that research institute as an aside because I believe in it so much I think it is. I think omega-3 has the pharmacological profile. Like it has the pharmacological potential like to act like drugs but it's the safety profile of a nutrient. Yeah. You know what I mean? Does that make sense? Yeah. So it's like I think you know, people are so interested in aging.
Drugs and Metformin, and
this this omega-3 stuff. Yeah. Oh
no, five year increased life expectancy prints, preventing muscle, disuse, atrophy, and it's sensitizing. Now that might not matter so much. For the your Bros you were talking about that are taken in 300 grams. They're little like they're getting their protein but it might matter when they're injured, right? You're getting a surgery. The can't lift. Yeah, train. They can't train because that's where omega-3 shines because the disuse atrophy sets in
Julie, when is your older right? Because then you like you know your it's so much more hard on the body. Like you're not able to recover like a young person can like young person, can bounce back but the older people don't write and then not only that omega-3 in the studies that were done I should caveat this. The studies have been done in young. People they're going to be repeated an old people but because they have to be short, like you can't, it's not ethical because you knowing knowing how you know just being bed.
Ridden for, you know, period of time is so devastating for another person. It's hard to like do those studies, right? So you have to, like, really know that this might protect them before you do it. So right, most of the stuff, stunning young people. Now, there's other studies that have been done with like Omega-3s in in combination with exercise and older people. It does seem to improve muscle mass and strength but of course in combination with, with exercise. Yeah, yeah. So, you know, I think it's, it's really hugely important because there's a lot of people that
Taken a lot of protein you're just talking about and then having that omega-3. Now, again, this is emerging data, but I think that it'll continue to emerge where it's sensitizing the muscle to amino acids and it's doing it because your muscle cells, they're made of Omega-3 and it's changing probably the way these Omega-3s are transported at a changing, you know, a lot of things inside of it. So I'm really excited about that that data because it's like for one you
Can you can be more strategic about like oh I'm going to get a surgery now if you're already taking you know 2 grams of Omega-3 day, it's built up. Its built up in yourself. By the way, that's another thing. That was important, that was learned in the studies if you take someone that's naive and not taking omega-3 and they're low on it, it takes four weeks for it to build up in the muscle tissue. Yeah. Four weeks. And so if you find a study that protocol. Yeah. If you find a study that was done that didn't do the protocol. They did. Usually the way they do these studies is they like put a cast on someone and they immobilize them for a period like two weeks.
That Rafi right? They'll do they give them the omega-3 at the same time? They do that. That's not the way to do it. You have to preload them, right? They need it to get in there muscle. That's the whole way it works.
It's not, it's not don't know. For people surgery coming up,
right? So it's kind of like if you're, you know, that, that disuse atrophy. So I cut it by like half disuse, atrophy, that was a lot.
That's, that's incredible. Yeah, it's a, I mean, if you looked at like, so for me, what, how could I, if
Look at my routine now, you saw part of it, you know laughter and shoot and you know, kind of what I eat, right. Am I on the right path or am I like because people when I when I had my full-time job for sure. And we'll talk. Let's talk about sleep too, because it's like people like me who work have goals. They want to achieve like being a bow hunter in the Mounds that takes training that takes time, we have a family so I would like scale back to get everything I needed to get.
Done. I couldn't do it without sacrificing sleep. That's only thing that I could mess around with his sleep. Everything else is like, no, I had to get my miles. And I had to see the family had to be at work all day, so I'm like, well, I'm not going to get eight hours of sleep. If I can get five, I got three more hours to put in work and now tell me about sleep, and, and just that in general routine, because I feel to be honest, pretty dang good for being old as hell. I feel like
Like the best I've ever felt at
55 pretty dang, good too. Well thank you but yeah. Yeah it's your thoughts on well here. There's lots of there's lots of little Nuance. Yeah. So I want to hear I mean I would say first and foremost sleep is hugely important for health, right? We know that you obviously know that yes right and it's important for brain function. Immune function work, I like everything. Right. But there's also you know, a genetic Factor as well so there are people that it's called a
No type where, you know, there's the night owls. There's the people that don't sleep, they only sleep five hours a day and they feel great every day when they wake up, they don't feel tired, right? There's individual variation in how much sleep everyone needs. Now, there's been a whole team of scientists have come together and they've said, okay, human adults need about seven hours of sleep a day for optimal, you know, everything. And so they say 8 hours because the reason
They say eight, is because an hour, like there's like the wake-ups, the, you know, so you can basically all that about. Yeah. So you shave off an hour but it's really, it's not the, it's the seven hours. That's the key, right? So, and again, that's the average, but there are people that don't fall in that average, you know, this isn't everyone. So that's first and foremost, important to keep in mind, right? There is individual variation. Then on, I think the next layer to that, which is, I think you said and it's really important. You said, I got to get my miles in.
Like that was first. Yeah, I got to get my miles in
exercise and that's as much mental as physical for me. It's just, like, I got to know, I'm putting in the
work. Yeah, well, the exercise, and it's the thing, like I think that if you were going to, if there was one or the other, you had to make a decision. What am I going to pull from? What am I going to cut back on?
It's going to be the sleep because there's, I mean, I don't know that there's anything that's more powerful than exercise for improving. You know, health for improving muscle Health, bone health. You know your immune Health brain health and also mood, you know, you know how you feel, which then again if you feel good, you're motivated, if you're motivated, you do stuff, like you're going to eat better, you're going to like all that stuff.
So there have been there. Have been like a big study that was done, that looked at sleep duration and all-cause mortality. Again cardiovascular does my brother mortality plays a big role in it as well but people that slept it was like eight hours, 72 hours a day they had the lowest all-cause mortality compared to people that were getting you know five hours of sleep. Something like that. I don't remember the exact numbers but give or take except when they
Looked at the people in that group that we're getting the, let's just call it five hours, less sleep, they were Physically Active. Those people had the same mortality as the people that were just getting, you know,
eight hours, eight hours. Yeah.
And, and, and this was like, even people that were exercising getting eight hours. So this isn't like, you know what I mean if you want to optimize everything. So so at the end of the day exercise seems to help correct some of the bad effects of sleep loss. And I've
I've measured this in myself and their studies on it with glucose regulation because sleep is really important for glucose regulation rights insensitivity. And when I was a new mother, I was getting no sleep, right. I was measuring my glucose with the continuous glucose monitor, is getting all that data and it was Black and White Night and Day difference. I mean, it was so obvious and so repeatable, that, you know, if I went and I was doing, I was because there's times when I, when I was a new mother.
Mother. When I was like, I can't have an exercise. Like, I couldn't like I just, it was
like no energy but you're
exhausted. I had no energy and then it was it was. Yeah. And then it was like, I had to be with my son. Andre didn't like it was just that was that was
it nothing all your phone, you'll
do anything like you you sacrifice your health, you give your health to your child, your suck, it away from me, you know, right. Like that's that's what you do. Yeah, literally but then I had that data and that was like even if I'm like just dog-tired like there's and I
If I exercise, I'm back to me. Yeah, and not pre B pre-diabetic crazy. Like, you know, Rhonda
what's crazy is people like they'll say I'm not going to exercise because I didn't sleep well that shit's the
black what they
should do first. Yes that's obstacle. You should do dilute
opposite. Yeah, if you fact, the more tired you are. Yeah, the more you should work out. In fact, when you're not tired, that's when you should not work out. It's like it's actually the
opposite has its Ben
Back to Baseline. Yeah. Or even above see that's, you know, yeah. Because yeah, if you're above because of all the other benefits, right? All the other different things you're doing for your, for your body, for your mind. So yeah, I mean, just in general, if you're just talking about sleep and performance your back to Baseline, but you you've gained so much in other areas. So,
yeah. So if there's one thing that you should do when you're tired train do everything. Yeah, exactly nothing else like train.
Like, do that? Like, that's the thing. And that's what I learned from from my data and I did it. You know, I was, I did my, I was on the bike and I was hard. But like, but then you feel great after right? So then yeah. And then it's like, oh yeah, I was so tired and I felt like crap and now I don't know. I don't, what do you know?
Do you know how? I mean there's a few things like social media, so crazy, but people are so frickin protective of a couple weird things. Music
Craze is one of them. Do you put up some music? People really hate that. That's not, that's not real country. Anyways, like music is, people are very passionate and fired up but sleep there so protective over their sleep. So if you're saying like, I didn't get, I got this much sleep and I'm fine. They will say why you're an idiot. Why, you know, you need to get more sleep. You're like
people, if they've had their chronotype
measured, people are so protective over laying know. Steve
is important like
Important like it is the repair time
that crazy about it. They're like because they love to
sleep but I also think people like to argue and sound
smart. Yeah, that's true. So I mean yeah you know
but no sleep is definitely important but there's so many other things like again, it's like everything's Nuance. There's always like there's we're just going to make things right, you know, gorgeous important because what? Oh, my gosh exercise, like all that, it's your you're increasing repair process, that's what you're doing on, Omega-3s are important,
you know, there's Nuance to everything in my weird.
Redneck mind. It always be like I'm putting in these miles. I'm sacrificing. This is what setting me apart. Nobody has a great story about how much sleep they got, you know what I mean? But they have stories about. Hey, I trained my ass off. And I did this 200 mile run because I have worked what I was doing before and I was capable of this. Yeah. How much sleep I got during that? Nobody gives a fuck about. So it's like, what, what are we? You know I'm trying to like do cool. You know? Amazing.
Shit and sleep is like not that sent to you
sleep like on a, like, a hundred mile run that you like, how do you do
that? I knows know if you're trying to like know 100 mile run. That's usually just a day. So you'll just push through, you know? I mean, even little kids, let's stay up all night, they'll stay up all night, right? Yeah. It's that second night so I can on a 200 mile, run your into your second night and that's where that's where like Courtney. I don't know if you know her according to Walter.
I swear, she kind of made famous the she was seen hallucinating. So she one of her famous when she had on a t-shirt. She saw a leopard in a hammock. Does the second night? The second night is when this crazy starts stuff, starts happening with your brain. So like we both. Did she ended up winning? It is first time. You know, she kind of came on the scene. Joe Rogan was following me as the Moab 240 says, 240 miles. It took me.
78 hours. So we're getting into three three nights I slept for I would say two hours in those three days, you know because you just have to the clock, never stops. But that's the first night you're fine. You're just tired, you know, whatever you're just you're active. So you're not even that tired. You're just pushing but the second night is where people really that makes a difference between. Are you going to win? Can you still perform? Are you is your body going to break somehow?
Either mentally or physically. But that's where it gets into the hard one. This the second night of the to, right? That's not a credible. I don't know what's happening, but all I know is, I've seen people in these races and I've seen, you know, there's another type of race. That's called a backyard Ultras, like the last man standing. So what they do is for miles an hour and then, however, long that takes you, you can rest if you get done in under an hour. But at the our on the, on the
You know exactly on the hour you have to be at the starting line again and then you run for more miles and then you go do that as long as you can and so she won that. She one time she wanted to rent 283, Mi 4 miles at a time every hour. And to do that, you know, they might sleep and she's again made this famous but it's like if you sleep for a minute,
It's like a control-alt-delete reset because I've been so exhausted. I remember this time to, I was with my brother. I slept I felt like I slept forever. That's like a woke up and I'm like, how long was I asleep? And he's like a minute and I felt fine. Your, you reset. You can, you can't get away with that forever. But I've seen people do incredible things on one to five minutes asleep. That's crazy. Do what would be happening? Do you know,
you know, probably the
Stress hormones and stuff. I mean also like because depending on the time of day like this is all on a clock like your hormone production neurotransmitter, put
in all these people doing this or not normal, like the quote normal people, but I do. I've been fasting about that control-alt-delete reset. Like what the fuck is happening? You know,
that's the first time I've even heard that, I mean
that's cup and felt like she got eight hours of
sleep, you crazy? Yeah, that's right.
Could speculate but I have I have no idea. In fact, I can't like my speculation is even just terrible, so I won't even do it. Yeah,
but your, I mean, this is, you know, your but your speculation probably more accurate than most, but
who knows, you know, I mean it's like I get that like again, I was saying like, if you get that like because everything is on like, a clock, my circadian clock like you know, just like we have our schedules that we do, right? You run at this time, you like all you have your business call, you know, like there we have a
Was like our body has a schedule for everything. And you know, so like if you're all of a sudden making that cortisol and having that cortisol, Awakening response that usually you have like first thing in the morning, right. It's happening. Even though you've gotten, you know, whatever minute minute of sleep or you know, then it's like, okay, there's the Awakening response, you know. But the interesting thing about this too is performance-related and I kind of recently been both cognitive and you know, physical getting sort of diving
Young into this and trying to apply it to my life. And in fact, we went for a run. We went, we did the Run hike. What that was big for? Five wasn't?
Yeah, like that. I try to do it. The hottest part of the day, so around for
is wrong for. Yeah, yeah. So it's interesting because between, so, like 1:30 in the afternoon to about 5:00 in the afternoon, so like is 130 considered late afternoon. I don't even know. Yeah, what mid-afternoon
Three is
late. Yeah, so 130 and that's at 1:30, it's like muscle coordination is at its peak. So your muscle like 2:30, you start to have, you know, it's coordination. Oh, and then like something else with speed and endurance and cardiovascular endurance and muscle strength or like strongest like 4:00 or 5:00 p.m. 5:00 p.m. again this is all on a clock thing. So it's like, you know, training at that time kind of makes sense.
From a performance aspect. If you're looking, you know, for a little best. Yeah, should be at your best but also cognitive stuff. So like, no, we're talking and it's 10:30, you know, in the morning. I feel dumb. No actually. Well, depends on what makes you feel smart? So we most again on average, this is like, not everyone. There's the night owls and you might be an outliar to or you fall into a different category where, you know, you just don't fit the average.
That's important, right? But on average, most people are, they're better at problem, solving there better at learning things. So if you need to learn things at what time at around, not 10:00 in the morning. So, 10 is like the peak. So if like, you're like, I want to hear what Rhonda saying? Yeah. Like right now, you're like, you're actually better at learning that their problem solving learning. You know, that's sort of cognitive process is really good at 10:00 in the morning, but creativity, if you're wanting more free,
A flow creativity. That's better late afternoon early evening. So that's like and it's funny cuz I try and try to organize my day more. And, you know, it's it always gets me. People always want to have zoom calls first thing in the morning. I'm like that's my that's my peak time. I don't want to like,
do the wait like this. Yes, s
up my like Peak Performance time when like the stuff I do. I need to problem-solve I need to figure things out. I need to like retain information and so like that's the time I
Ye'd whereas like, okay, let's have a meeting later in the day. Like, you know, for me, it's like, I'm already like a did what I needed. So or feel like you want to be more creative and it's also interesting that all the creatives, like, you know, like, you don't ever go to a comedy show with your coffee in this late. It's always late. Always late? Yeah. And it's like, well, that you say they right there, they call it a bit. I don't know what the Yeah, they ride in probably late, but also like they improv, like, hell, when they're up on stage. Yeah. It's like, it's like a dialogue.
With the audience and 11:00 at night, right? It's always late. That's like the creative and you always hear about like the artists like Salvador Dali, Dali used to like put a spoon on his nose. I read this. I mean you never know right? He would put a spoon on his nose and the reason he when he would he would fall asleep with it and then it would wake him up when I would fall and that was when he would like paint that's awesome. Where it's like, that creative
moment. I was going to ask you to because I was just thinking about these races, it's like the worst time of a
Ace is 2:00 in the morning. It's like, you know, dark ass frickin middle of the night, but once that Sun starts to pop, are like, first gets a little gray, then the sun's your are
energized really. That support us all waiting
response. If you're just, if you can make it till sunrise because a lot of people, they struggle all night, but once that Sun hits. Oh, man.
So, two things. Interesting. One, so the Sun so bright, light exposure is what activates the cortisol? We
clear.
Sponsors about this nonsense,
right? And so that is what's going to give you energy like the cortisol, you know everyone's a cortisol, bad cortisol bad, yes, chronic cortisol is bad but the cortisol Awakening response is something that's a it's a part of our biological clock and sunlight, exposure is what really activates it. And so if you're getting that first thing in the morning, you're going to feel energized and more. You're out in the world, right? Or the sun, even
if you've run for two days. But
I mean, I don't know, but that's incredible.
But the other thing you said that's interesting is 2 a.m. is the hardest and why that's interesting is because that is when your body temperature is at its lowest and I don't like I know there's some this isn't like hard Sciences more speculation. So there's like there's researchers out there trying to figure out why muscle performance and everything. You know, cardiovascular performance endurance is better, you know, at the 5:00, like time of day and it's because your core body
Juror is at its highest and so there's some theories that, it affects, you know, muscle performance, and it's affecting endurance, it's helping and that being, you know, being at its coldest has the opposite effect. I don't know. I mean, it kind of was just interesting that you said that to am
is 100% true. And then also, you, you realize and Hunters know those two but its coldest right before the sun comes up. So maybe it's because it's been dark, the longest read before the sun comes up. So just in general,
General temperatures dropping, but you are, you are noticeably colder. Like, saying hour before Sunrise. Then you had been unlike the two in the morning, but at that stretch right there, it's like miserable. And if you can make it to that, it feels like a complete, like everything changes. Like you just flipped a switch Sun's up now. You're like fuck. I'm back, I'm back.
Well, that's what every day is supposed to be like, you're supposed to go outside first thing in the morning, right? And it's like, I'm back. This is the
art of my clock. I mean, that's what it does. Is it resets the clock? You know, it's important for
young people. Miss that a lot. So they either, they're at work already, or they're not up yet or
cycle. People don't go
outside but if you're in the mountains and that's not pops you like I'm back
bitches. Yeah. The difference between like when you're like let's say camping or you know, you're somewhere where you're out and and you're going, it's dark and you're probably getting sleepier. Also like, you're not staying up all night as much. It's like you do get sleepy earlier. You don't have like
Official life nothing to nap right bed? No phone. Yeah. And then and then you wake up in the morning when the sun's out and you feel great and mr. It is but it's one of those things where like what you know, people won't like, how can you people ask, like, how can I improve my sleep right? Like, how, like I my sleep is bad. Like, how, what can I do? And I think one of the most important things is early bright, light exposure, and it from a circadian perspective for multiple reasons, one is what we talked about. Like,
Like it's resetting your clock so that your clock knows when it start to, you know, when it's time to start making melatonin, which is a hormone that helps you get sleepy your body's like, okay, this is sleep time. It's on a clock. If you don't have that anchor, then it's all wonky, right? You know, and then you put the bright lights on at night. The blue light switch, then tell your brain? No, it's still daytime. I mean that just adds to it right? The challenge but like the bright light also is again, it's the energy. The cortisol, Awakening response you make serotonin
And also from the bright light exposure and then you get motivated because you feel good, you're motivated, right? And then like you're saying you're outside and you got through the hard part that 2 a.m. or whatever where you're like, this is like so hard Sun comes out and then all of a sudden you're making serotonin, you feel better, so you're motivated, the motivations I can do this, right? Like, so, I mean, this is, I don't know if that's what's happening, but I don't know. But the the bright light does increase the
serotonin. Some of the very best endurance racers
As can they whether it's intentional or do this, mentally more disciplined but they don't slow down at that midnight to 4:00 in the morning. They can everybody else is getting colder, you're tired, obviously. You're slowing down the best according to be in there. The best the best ever can push just like it's middle of the day and that is is so hard to do and it's amazing but that's that's why we're all different
Yeah, yeah. Well, and speaking of that, how the hell did you get to be so smart? Like, were you always like in school? What does how do you get to be dr. Rhonda Patrick, tell me about that
job. I have sort of, like, I started a bug club when I was in second grade s. OK, you know. So I've always sort of been interested in science. Hmm. You know
where wait, a bug club? Yeah. Or
buk. Buk bug
oug club. Okay,
so we would go around and like collect bugs.
And I study them starting out with like glue, it was terrible, but we'd like glue around the bug. So we trap it, you know? So like couldn't move and get a Mac running for the
bugs but kind of fun for you guys. Hey, it's no different than a did you ever do like the microwave or the magnifying glass and just burn
ants. I didn't burn them but I did look at
them because you can get that sun and like, I don't know why that was fun. I don't have a y
chromosome. So
that's probably the
Friends. Yeah that's a boy thing.
But yeah. So you know I was it's just kind of one of those funny things where I think in college, I thought I was going to be a marine biologist. I was a surfer in college I Tha surfing and I was like
what was high school like? So if you were a bug club
was a track track. Yeah, I got under running and a little bit in a Grunge music and like you know bonnafon uh Smashing Pumpkins Rage Against the Machine Pearl Jam. Yeah.
I'm like, I still love all that, you know,
so good combo beIN.
Yeah, but I think I, when I started to really get into like, David Attenborough, documentaries from Nature Documentaries, that was high school. And and then it was like, oh, I want to go out and like, you know, go on a boat and like, study more like the ocean, and it's like endless. It's like, there's like, you know, I just got really interested in the ocean, but as I started to like so I went to UCSD as I started to like, take all these science,
Says, like it was like far removed from like, you're like doing lab work, you're in the lab and then, and then I just wanted to challenge. It was like, I was like, oh, this is hard. So I just kind of kept I majored in chemistry, which is like one of the hardest. You know, and I was terrible, a bunch of got it. I was I was, I don't know. It was. I barely like it was hard. Yeah. Well, just say I was taking, you know, like physical chemistry was hard. I had to take like three chemistry classes and like,
Three calculus classes to get into the like, the physical chemistry. And then it was like, it was just like, I don't even understand this stuff that's at that point. Like and I've done interning and chemistry labs and I was like, I don't want to do this, right? Yeah. It's these people are nerds and what really got me into biology and aging was when I were I graduated from college and I knew I wanted to go to grad school but I was like I don't wanna be a chemist anymore. This is like boring like I just it's not fun. Yeah, I like I like life.
And like I want to apply it to myself, kind of, you know, I was just like I was like synthesizing peptides and stuff and I just felt like I wasn't doing anything and interesting to me. Yeah, so I started working at the Salk Institute and that I worked in an aging lab, where we were looking at these little nematode worms and they have, I mean, I don't know how many genes they have, but they have very simple. Like there's genes that are similar to humans. It's called homologous and so like they have an insulin like
Scepter a gene that's I can into like receptor igf-1 like all this stuff, right? And and they're really good for manipulating genetics, to go. Oh, look, this is what happens. When you manipulate genetics humans have jeans like this. Like maybe we could somehow learn something about humans, right? And and so I was doing these experiments where he's taking these worms and they live on average about two weeks like 15 days and I would change like one gene where it's like okay we're going to lower their insulin signaling pathway, so their insulin and
Jeff. One, like the whole instance, very tied to insulin, you knock it down and these worms went from living 15 days to 30 days and not only the, and I'm looking at this with my own eyes, I'm doing it. You know, like not only were they living 30 days when they were, like 20 days old, which they should have been long dead, they were moving around like a young worm. They were late because they, you can they you put them on a little petri dish with like e-coli. There's a gar on it, any coli bacteria, they eat bacteria and
And they just kind of move around. You see them and as they start to age, they get slower and they like eventually just don't move much and it kind of just feeding, but these worms were like, bam, you know? It was like they were young and at that moment I was like we have insulin signaling pathway like this is and this is incredible, right? So that was kind of the start was like I want to study and then it kind of morphed into like things that are like I could apply like nutrition-wise. Like you know like what can we do to change the way we age?
With our diet and our lifestyle. And so that's kind of how it was. Just like a one of those things were marine
biology and then you like, quality of life performance type things. That what you're, that's what you enjoy most.
Now, I really am super interested in still like aging and when I say it's aging and, like, improving the way we age like anti-age. So, yes, performance. And you know, increasing, you know, our health span so
Greasing the risk of getting cancer, cardiovascular disease, Parkinson's disease, dementia, like not just living longer and not even necessarily having to live longer but not living life. Disabled, right, right? Like enjoying life, like being young and performance. Like, if you are, yeah, there's there are traded like, you can do stuff. That'll give you performance, enhancements, that's not good for you, right? Like we can agree on that course, but you can do things that are going to give you a performance enhancements that are good for you.
And those things if you're going to get, if you're going to, if you're being physically active, and your that's that's going to affect the way you age, for sure, it's going to change the trajectory of your disease risk
pattern. What what do you think? Because when I and people say this all the time, but back in the day, say, 55 years old, which is what I am, 55 seemed old as hell. You'd see a 55 year old guy and he looked old, and now you see, Joe's three months older than me. So he's
got, he's going to be 56 like, in two days but now you see people in their 50s and they're like,
What this guy's a freaking Beast, or this woman is, you know, running Ultras in this crushing it. How have we fought off the aging process? I mean, what's been the biggest change? Do you think?
Well, I think, first and foremost knowledge, like we know a lot more now, right? I mean, so like we know how important protein is, we know how important some of these vitamins and minerals and getting them. And we know how important it is to exercise and like smoke or not smoke. And, you know, there was there's a lot of things that we know.
Think from just access to information that has helped. Because you know, when you have the information, then you can make the Improvement rights like not having the
information that's really tough to build to do thing. Yeah.
You know, but on the other hand, it's like, well obviously, we also we aren't dying from infectious diseases like we were antibiotics. I mean there was a time when it was like me, you know, something could be a death sentence, you know. That that is just minor to us
now. I mean women died all the time in childbirth. Yeah. Yeah, that's hardly ever
happens.
Now right now. I mean, I know I think about that all the time where it's like that like being like getting pregnant was one of those things was probably like so exciting, but it was like scary. It's like this is a
yeah, could not cost. Like I
could die and like, yeah, I mean, that's so advances in medicine, you know, obviously, you know, make a difference as well, right? But but then, on the other hand, we do have a lot of, we have an obesity epidemic, you know, and there's the over. I don't want to say, oh,
Nutrition. Because it's a little misleading because, like people that are obese or some of the most efficient and important like vitamins and minerals and fatty acids, you know, because they're yes are getting a lot of calories but they're getting empty calories, you're getting processed foods. And yeah, you know, well
that, you know, I played that clip. I was asking if you knew that woman from Australia, I think she is. But like she there's a clip. We're it was talking about Putin and Russia which obviously we're not going to, we want to be Russia. But the his point,
Was he Outlaws GMO? Like it's all got to be organic or you're not growing it and then he talks about the Western World us and that how we're overfed lazy overmedicated and it's like like saying that we're weaker than the Russians, you know what I mean? So what's your thoughts on like GMO and healthy diet and and that I don't know I'm
You mentioned obesity. I remember taking my boys to the movie and we're standing in the line and looking around. And I their young kids, it's like this probably shitty parenting, but I look around and I'd be like I said, you guys. See, take a look, the look around. I said this is average, we don't want to be average, average isn't good enough because if you look at the average, quote American doesn't look great.
The average Americans are overweight. Yeah. And you know like so I think
I think there's a lot. I think there's a lot of new data that it's come out now. And in fact, I'm about to cover this in a Q&A on Friday where process, the things that are in all of our packaged foods and processed foods, you know, that. So you're talking about GMOs. I'm, it's a little different but it's still I think very relevant because, you know, people are eating a lot of easy food, right? It's like you. Yeah, I'm and, and even something that you think is like a whole food, it's like, oh, like maybe Whole Foods made it and it's, you know,
There's stuff in there. You know, we've got the gums and this stuff that you can't pronounce, you know, and then there's the red number 40 in the yellow and that stuff is banned in Europe and it there's so much data. Now showing that it like exacerbates ADHD and may even play a role in causing or in especially with a unlocking a genetic potential there within kids. And so like some kids will eat like this, all the candies that are like brightly colored with all this junk. Yeah. And it's
A horrible for them on top of the sugar that's in it. But we're talking about the artificial color. So I think there's a lot of stuff that we haven't understood and, you know, everything takes so long eventually, you know, it's one of those things where then data catches up. And so now we're learning. Oh, the things that are like part of the processing process that make it more stable. You know, we have the nitrites and the nitrites are now linked to colon cancer, and
You know, they're considered a carcinogen and it's like, well, do you have to put a night right in your lunch meat? Can you not do that? You cannot do that, right? Is that there's salt and other thing. I mean, like, there's other ways of doing it. So I do think there's, you know, and then there's the, the glyphosate, right? And that again, is there can be fear-mongering, but I think there's now data coming out where it's like, oh they're just dumping this stuff on like oats, you know, and and then you're just
getting tons and tons of this glyphosate from oats because they're wanting to mass produce it. And you know,
why would they be putting on a notes? It just helps
productive because they're giving their, they're basically, they're genetically engineering, the Odes to be resistance to the pesticides that they're putting on so that it kills off all the insects and stuff, so they can grow more. And so there there are tons of glyphosate, which is a pesticide like it's Roundup, right? Yeah, in oats because the oats
And GM mode in a way. So I don't know that it's the GMO. Like the fact that you're like, you can like you can put, you can make you can make something GMO like GMO it in a healthy way. Like you can, you know, make let's say a tomato make more lycopene, which is very beneficial like so I don't know that, it's the, the GMO exactly that bad from the oh, it's so much is that they gave it a gene that makes it they can dump tons of pesticide on it and the pesticide you're getting
So like you couldn't like if they didn't have those genes like that, the pesticide at the concentrations they use because it's like, oh now we can really wipe out all the pests, right? All the insects and really grow at a lower dose. If they didn't have those genes, the oats like the, oh, wouldn't you know, grow, right? Like, you wouldn't have any of it growing. So whatever, you know, whatever we're talking about money-making thing. It's a money-making thing for
the people that are originated this process. It's like we can make more and sell more make
Money. Yeah and there's also I guess that demand thing to write words like, I mean, I don't know how to solve the, you know, we got more like the people and how to supply all the oats for them like I don't I don't know what's in control there but money is always in control. The money is always in the equation, it's always part of it, right? It's yeah, I want to say it's the only thing but, you know so the so I mean the thing with the GMO is like it's always for me. I it's not like a black and white thing. Yeah, everyone's always it's got to be cheap.
GMOs or bad, what are the other? But like I would love to, I mean can we start making microalgae, make more omega-3 so that we can just Harvest that microalgae easy without like having to kill all the fish and then maybe maybe the everything would be more natural. Like, you know what, you know what I mean. We're
not like black and white, always, it's not like an why ya.
So, so the GMOs I think can be, you know, harmful especially in the context when you're making a gene that's like making them resistance to pesticides, you can dump more pesticides on them, the food.
And then and then you're you're eating these this bowl of oatmeal that you're giving to your child, right? And it's like well, children are always more sensitive, right? Like yeah, they don't like the the blood-brain barrier. We were talking about this a little bit. I think I was talking about this with Jan and John yesterday about blood-brain barrier development. It's like thought it happened. You know like you're getting a more developed one around like I don't know age for maybe. Yeah. But I mean even even if it's not even, if it is developed like you know they're still like their endocrine system like this is development when you
Like start perturbing things in that sensitive period. Like, like there's more consequences, right? Then an adult and adult. It's like, oh, maybe cancer risk is raised like whatever, how many years later?
But like that your developed already developed. And I think I think I remember I talked to Jen about this a camp but they changed the vaccine schedule or whatever changed in like the 90s for the kids. And that's what she's focused on too because it's like, it did from the studies that
She was talking about and shared with me that changed in the 90s and says, then the vaccines have been it's different than when we were
kids. It is and I, you know, as a parent. So, you know, I've always been, I call myself a sort of cautious Baxter and I mean, I guess it's with respect to the doing the childhood vaccines, you know, like I do think that vaccines are important. I mean, like, smallpox was eliminated and children do get infectious diseases and they can be
Devastating for a young child if they're spreading, you know, with that said I think there's a more cautious way of giving, you know children vaccines. And so what I decided to do was I well what are all these new vaccines? What do I do? What do I really need? Am I going to put my newborn baby some others? Like put their six month old infant or four month old infant in a daycare? Yeah. And at that point, like, you know, if that infant gets pertussis, I mean, it could be deadly, you know? So I didn't have to make a really
Our decision of giving my really, really young baby and important vaccine to prevent them from getting pertussis and like potentially dying. Right? Right. So I think there's a little individual variation there, right? Everyone's circumstances different. So I didn't have I, you know, didn't have to put my child in daycare. So, you know, I decided I was going to wait until the blood brain barrier. Was more developed because you know, immune things do cross over the brain and you know, there's there's immune responses that could.
Effect bring development. Yeah, and again, everyone's different, it doesn't always happen that like, as a mother, you like, well, if it could happen, right? Like, I don't want that wrist. Like, yeah, you know, you're protective and so, I did just the vaccines that were required for for school in the state of California, and I did them in singles and what does that mean? It means like, you're not mixing, you're not doing the MMR which already has three, you're not doing that combined with the Tdap, which also,
Is 3 and then the we're celebrating mean I don't know what I mean. So there's so like you. So for example you've got the measles the mumps and rubella MMR. So there's three different, it's antigens that you're, you know, you're basically it's not just one virus that you're trying to protect against, right? There's be but so I, you know, I did each one. It was like okay MMR and then it was, you know, the DTaP and then it was, you know, varicella which is a chicken pox. And then, you know, Happy's, I didn't combine them and
And it's weird because doctors they sort of do they say, oh, just come in and you'll get the MMR, they'll get this, they'll all three of them. Yeah, you know, all three different vaccines not. I mean, so we're talking many different combinations of product to elicit an immune response, right? Yeah. Because they think it's easier on the parent and not have to go multiple times. And they think it's easier on the child because they're not getting multiple shots. And I don't know, just three shots, make more difference in one. I don't think so. Like, I think any parent, too?
It's not in a not, it's not necessarily going to do it. I was cautious because it was like, I am immune responses, do you know, they can be strong? Yeah, and the more your eliciting, it the stronger their response, right? And so,
I think that's a good point that you looked at it, objectively. And you made a decision based on risk factors for your child and your situation. That's the biggest thing. You did also mention that California required, this, and that, that
It is the biggest thing I think people had with the covid vaccine is like, they weren't given that opportunity to make a choice. When people are requiring it to do, have a job to do different things. That's, you know, I like that. You made that decision, you looked at and say, oh my my child, my son isn't going to be in daycare 4 months old. So I don't need to do that. That's where people struggled with. It was required, for certain things when I'm talking about covid. Specifically, that, that was the hard part.
For being that was a big. It was the mandates. I was never for the mandates. You know, it was, and it was one of the biggest mistakes. I think that our government. Yeah, made was trying to mandate a medical intervention like that. That is something I think Lessons Learned. Like if we look back Lessons Learned, that's a big one, like mandating a medical intervention like that. Like that's that's choice. That is choice, right? And a lot of people make the choice I made.
A choice, right? And if you don't want to, you know, I mean, some people decided to home-school, like, I know, I know parents that their children have like severe like anaphylactic allergies and they, they had a bad reaction to one vaccine and they're like, I'm not doing it. So they homeschool, they have like a pod but like going back to the covid vaccine since you brought it up, my my opinion like on the vaccine itself has evolved over time, it's changed. And I think the last time I spoke out
Publicly with, during the Delta wave. So this was before Omicron, this was like, august/september of 2021. Yeah, so a few years ago, yes, things were very different and in my opinion, at that time, you know, even even though the Delta variant was still, the vaccines were not as robust at preventing transmission as like the the original, you know, variant or even the beta variant was like, 95% it was down to like seventy sixty percent maybe 40.
I it was my personal experience also that I think contributed where, you know, it's the Delta variant. Like I knew people that died from it like that got from covid, right? You know, where it's like my own personal experience with such that, I was vaccinated, my family like so much of my family. My friends, like nobody had a bad reaction. Right? And you know personal experience does mean a lot.
Hey doctors are humans. You know. Yeah, so so
for me, it was kind of like well,
Not only my personal experience but like if you looked at all the preprint data like this is, we were in informational shortage at the time course, you know, and I think the thing that I got wrong and looking back on, it really was myocarditis risk and it wasn't that I can necessarily. I got it wrong. As actually reading data, that was preprint data. So the data was saying that, you know, even young men had a higher risk of myocarditis inflammation of the heart from from Sarge Cove to virus. And again, this was the
ETA at the time. Yeah. Versus the MRNA vaccines. And so it's like, well you only can talk about the data. Now, if I had had personal experience, had knew someone that had gotten myocarditis from the vaccines, that probably would have changed my opinion. Even even reading that
data. Do you think that the data you are reading was was, I don't doctored or manipulate it a little bit or they with the people sharing that data where they excluding.
I have no.
Tell you this, it was coming so fast, there's so many ways, there's we data is there's so many ways to like make mistakes like and not intentionally to like it's so easy. It's so easy and things were so stressed at the time. And if things are coming so fast and it was evolving and, you know, like Omicron came, you know, and this was like late 2020. This was like December 20 21, right? As it was like turning 20 22 and Omicron came. That's kind of when everything changed for me in my perspective.
Of because for 10 Micron, you know the the virus itself had so many different mutations in the spike protein where, you know the virus itself was more transmissible but it also had mutations that made it bind. It was not getting deep into the lungs and so people weren't getting his sick, they weren't dying like the older people, except they weren't dying. And I mean, that's even true now, right? I mean, like, hope it's like, does he have anyone talk about it? I don't.
Like you know, you know. So we had this athlete here the other day who he said he was test for covid. He ran the hundred and he got third qualified for the world championship. So he's like, yeah, even covid. Couldn't stop me and I'm just like, Kofi, just fucking nothing. So it's right right now, right now, right now,
it's not right. And you know, the so the Omicron itself to me was was the vaccine. It was because so many people got it. Mmm, that we now had immunity and, you know, so fast forward. You know, 2023 now we've had
I've had time to read studies that are actually now. Not just preprints, right? Okay. This is like peer-reviewed, you know, and even now there's conflict. But what changed it for me, you know, is reading a few studies where it then became clear that, you know, that there was one study out of the UK where the myocarditis risk of younger people. So, 40 years, old and younger was higher from from vaccines versus Search scope to write and
At that point I was like, right? Wow like this you know like it's first of all the vaccines aren't stopping transmission. Like once Omicron came, it was like transmission, was it wasn't, it was like what's the point? It's not stopping transmission, you know. Back when I talked about it, like there was it was like a, you know, it's kind of like again the benefit risk where I was like you know, it's it's still sopping transmission, like maybe I'm all gross and the information is like I didn't I just didn't
Myocarditis thing. I just didn't. It wasn't there yet for me? Yeah. You know what I mean? I think and I changed my mind. Yeah. I changed my mind respect that anybody could expect, you know, I, well, that's kind of what you do when data comes out, you know, it's like, it's a sometimes, like things change and I don't know that every scientist feels that way. I think some are still will find data that says no. No. It's higher from our scope to but then you go. Well, is it Omicron because
You know, important right? Are we talking about like a virus that is long gone, that isn't even the same virus anymore because that's the other thing, right? Where it's like that was different like they were different, you know? Viruses. Yeah. So I do think, you know, like my whole family got vaccines, my parents have got it. Multiple like I said, now I'm sort of like, I don't know about the boosters because now they changed it. It's like this by bailant thing. And there was like, there's at this point. I just feel like
I I don't know about the risk with multiple like doing these, doing these mrnas shots, and it's multiple times that when I talk about over here and get this one thing. Yeah, you know and I think I've just it's just changed to the point where it's like, okay now Omicron all the sub variants of it which ever one were on. I don't even know. Yeah, it's not like people go to. I have like position friends or like yeah, I know this isn't it like they're not coming in the hospital anymore they're not. Thank you know this isn't a thing like
Was when it really Delta, it's totally not overwhelming the system, this isn't, you know, I don't even know, maybe some immunocompromised people, I don't even know, I don't know, maybe they should just not be around people, you know, but that's the other lesson on right shutdowns were worse than covid.
Yeah, definitely. I mean, it's, you know, I think anybody could respect a change, in an opinion or perspective given a changing data
swell and not only that it's so hard to tie, haven't talked about it because
And I'll get people just commenting on every post. Yeah, it's not even related. Just every post. I can't trust you. I can't just, and it's like, why are you following me for one? Like, if you don't trust me. Like I like I really try, you know, I do care and I'm not like it wasn't like an inauthentic like I just want to I think, you know, there were certain
your genuine about your stay.
There was and there were things that I felt people were misrepresenting at the time based off of what they were saying and one of them. One of them, the myocarditis risk I was
I mean, it was like that, that turned out to be true in my opinion. Now, you know, so I think, I think looking back it's like, well, we have a lot more information, but people, I think people just have their own emotional responses. They've had their personal experiences. Yeah. If you've, if, you know, someone that's had a bad reaction, right? You're going to be like, you're a liar. Yeah, I like and because that's strong, that's wrong, you know. And for me, it was the opposite. Like I knew a married couple. Were the husband got vaccinated.
Needed the wife did and she died of the Delta, you know, and it's like that was strong for me. Right. You know and then my uncle he was he was a he it like it was on a the hospitalized ventilator I mean it was like multiple people like yeah and we're in my in-laws like church their pasture? I mean like it was getting their orders know but like yeah yeah the personal I think we all have our you know and again like I said for me like I don't know as many people as perhaps you do but like no one was like, tell me about bad vaccine effects, it was like
I was tired for like a day, it's like, well, that's yeah, that seems doing right? But so, I do think that it should be talked about because apparently, some universities still require, mmm covid. Vaccine seems which it is because that is the population of people that are most affected, at least, with respect to myocarditis risk. And they're also the population that is least affected by covid, which isn't the same covid as it.
Was when you know it came from Wuhan China like it's evolved in such a way now that is so much less virulent. Most people have some natural immunity now because we've all been exposed even people who think they haven't had covid-19 exposed to some low-level. I have animal like it's a different time like there's no, you know,
and even at that shouldn't have been made. No, I mean I had it a couple times and, you know, just for me, I never ran less than 10 miles a day.
No matter how sick I was. So it wasn't like I wasn't even whatever, but where I really had an issue is, you know, you mentioned the college age kids, that's one thing. But then when they got down to what, six months old, you know, didn't they say that? It's now 6 months old can get it and Earth can can get are eligible for the vaccine. I'm like, why why are we doing this to ya? Did it did a kid under five ever? Even was there ever a
risk? I'm sure there's that Liars, right? But always, but most like
Like when we got it, like my son, it was like he was kind of tired for one day and then it was like, right, he was like doing sport. I mean, it was like he's not even sick. Yeah, for me, it was kind of like, like a mild flu. It was kind of, like, I just felt bad for a day and then, you know, had a runny nose.
I think it's a big part 2 of when it's so nuanced like that. And there is so much, you know, it's who your community, your part of, you know,
If you're part of a university type Community or a, the medical profession, it's a big difference for me in the redneck, Bow, Hunting Community, you know what I mean? So you're kind of influence by who you're around and the messages, those people are receiving and you're talking about and it's something so emotionally charged, you know, because like there's two camps. Well, and we were like the unvaccinated were the whatever the the scourge of the earth, you know, to some communities.
It was
Charge to also because the mandates they should never admit it. But, you know, the thing and I was talking about this with you earlier is that, you know, I think that some some more outraged. I personally think there's enough data and combined with circumstantial data so that makes me believe that this was the start scope to was made in a lab and, you know, to some degree. Like I get all the outrage for the vaccines. If you go on Twitter, like
That's what you see. And again, I get comments about it, but sorry, Iris, that's right, but like, if you read tweets, I mean, they're still called to, right? Yeah. He retweets then, you know, you'll you, you see, you read all that sort of like backlash. And I feel like it's almost like, it's been a distraction from like the real, like, vaccines were made as a solution to a big problem. Right. I think, you know, and it was one of the papers that it was from Georgia.
Church, whose like probably one of the world's best geneticist geneticist. He tweeted it back in like 20, 24. Anyone was talking about lab leak. Okay, he tweeted this study didn't say anything. Anything about it. Just tweeted a link and if you click on the link, you read the paper and it was like all about how the possibility that this was actually does this originated from a lab. And it was like molecular evidence looking at these fewer on sites and how they like, you know, just without getting into all the details, like how it possibly could have been
Been genetically. Like yeah, made, right. And it was at that point where I was reading that paper and then I started looking on psycho. Well has this ever been found and other viruses? And lo and behold I did find that naturally occurring. There was some other naturally occurring music mutations in that spot that did, you know, but it was very rare and also just the fact that the other circumstantial date, we're like ninjas came from like, how far from the Wuhan is just biology, right?
The wet lab was how far from it and what you're going. Hmm. Maybe the fact that those you know
like what do you think at first though because people were saying that from the you know, from the beginning I think Trump said
it was. I think even back in August of 20 21 I was heavily for that it was made in the
lab really. Okay.
Yeah. Just I don't think I've ever talked about it. So but is
still I mean educated people still would say, that's not
true in that
The thing that's scary is I'm a scientist always just like this isn't new right? I mean there's always disagreement right? But I think that they're that this needs to like be banned
honestly, what bad
gain-of-function research, where we're basically we are humans and even in the in the in the name of vaccines because it's like oh well we're manipulating these viruses and we're making them so they can infect humans and we're going to study so that we can make a vaccine in case it ever happens.
Right. But here's the here's the reality is that humans are as we were talking about their sloppy like just because someone has a PHD in as a scientist doesn't mean they're not going to fuck something up. Yeah. Yeah because let me tell you it happens all the time. I've done it many times. I've seen very esteemed scientist. I saw one injecting a mouse thankfully with Placebo and his hand hit like the tissue tissue culture like plastic thing but the syringe like
Backfired and went right into his chest. This guy's training me and I was like, what do we do? Where it's, you know, that the point is, is that yeah, that I was trying to make was that are flawed. Yeah. And that's I think that, you know, it the time that people should have gotten mad about this potential gain of function, will call it research that did. I think again, it's my opinion. Yeah. It's very likely that it originated from Allah.
Yeah, and it is terrifying to think that like what if this had a 90% fatality
rate could have wiped out the planet like that? I think that's kind of what people are worried about it. The very beginning, you know,
because people should be worried about it
because yeah, it was that's what they were selling. I was thinking I'm like God is ever gonna die from this shit? What's
called out? What? Oh yeah that's what I thought at first too. Remember when you would like wear gloves and walk across
like, but it actually could happen depending on what virus they're manipulating and making it fun.
Yeah, I mean it's the possibility and then
the fact of the matter is then maybe things mutate on its own and you know so yeah I mean I think the the pushback it's been it's been a lot on the vaccines and maybe if they weren't mandated that wouldn't have been such, people would have been more pushing back on the fact that this could have
been like how you made the decision with your son, you wait out the wit the risk, the situation, and that's how it should be,
right?
It's how it should be and every it's different. Every situation is different. And that's why people always ask me when you think about vaccines, like what do you thing about childhood, vaccines and say, are you going to put your four month old baby? Yeah. Like because like kids like viruses spread between kids, like, like wildfire. I mean, like, you know, so if you have again, a four-month-old baby in a daycare and like, there's something that's pretty bad spreading. Like that's, that's dangerous. Yes. So there's the risk, right? There's the benefit the risk. Yes.
Like what's the risk of giving the young baby you know the DTaP probably not so hot. It's not so high because the most people do do it right. Yeah. But there's risk, there's risk. Yeah. You know, especially with the combination of things to write. I mean genetics and there's all sorts of things playing a role
diet. Yeah, I mean, so, I mean, I know you've, I think, you know, you went on Rogan and I don't know. I can't remember how it went, but I remember there was a lot of you. Probably got a lot of backlash.
I mean and so I but to me personally I respect how you're able to be objective about it. Be like yes this was my opinion at that time and then I saw this data and now my opinion has changed and
that's right. My opinion is change it but particularly on myocarditis and there was a few things like with I felt like there was what? I don't even like this term misinformation, because I feel like our government is the one that was providing the most misinformation. And so now and at the time I
My called it that. And now I like it's like it's like one of those things were like. Now I hate that word you know, where I'm like, understand for me, you know what I mean? So and but there were things like there were some things that like the people were saying that. Again, I just, I felt like it was not true and not accurate. It wasn't data to support it, right? And I was again like so at the time it was a very different time. Delta Delta virus vaccines to. Some Derek were preventing transmission. They were preventing severe like his
We're getting a lot sicker. They were like older people. Yeah, older people not younger people. I'm right. There were younger people but generally speaking. Right, exactly. So, you know, and now we're at a point where it's like and at this, is with anything in policy. We're like everything you hold on to the old stuff. Like we're talking about the RDA for protein. Like we have new data people. Yeah. Come on. Let's change stuff right. You know people are still holding on till I really think some people are still like, okay, vaccines are preventing transmission, we need to get back slowly but they don't at all.
They don't have insurance and like it's not that severe cobras not that severe. So what are they? What are they doing, right? I don't really know right. But I do I am kind of glad we're talking about this I'm also a little terrified because I do think it's a it's an emotional thing and you know
I don't think I should be terrified because you it makes what you're saying makes sense.
Yeah and I don't want to make it like I was so wrong again. I mean it was that I was using
The data that I had which was preprint Data if you go back to August, 20 21, yeah, it was pretty print data with myocarditis when the fertility stuff, you know, like even now you see there's there's Publications there's no effect on fertility. But then you see all these Publications where it's like it's changing people's women's menstrual period something's happening and I don't think we understand what. So, I don't think we can say, it's not affecting fertility. Yeah. I, you know, so there's that's another part where I'm kind of following it.
It. But again, it's like, okay, well, there's the data saying it doesn't and you can find all the flaws with that data. But when you start to see, like, I mean, we're talking like 10 studies where it's like, no, woman's menstrual period. It's made women that were in menopause. Start menstruating again. Yeah, I mean, and that was for me, was wild. Like, what's going on? That's, that's trained now. Immune system affects, do, you know, like the immune system affects all that but like so,
I mean, I don't want to like make it it's again. I think that for me, I was doing the best I could with the information I had available with my personal experience. Yeah. Some people thought I was like paid off by the government like, you know, like look I, you know, I think now that I was I was I tried the best I could with that circumstance and with the myocarditis thing it was yeah, date has changed in my
And again you'll find scientist as I know, it's still the same it's but it there's enough data out there that to me it was like, no there's it's doing something in young people that is very
I you know, you talk about personal experience. I mean you know, my daughter got the vaccine because she was over to, you know, University and or a school and everybody's like, like I say the community or around and you hear from influences your decision.
So she's an adult, she can do what she wants. She knows how I feel about it, but anyway, she did it. All I know is one night five in the morning, I heard something bang, and I got up and went into her bathroom, and she was passed out on the floor. And right, as after the vaccine, I mean, it's like we had Bob Saget, he passed out, hit his head and died, right? So you
Bathrooms are hard counters. Anyway point is nothing to changed in our entire life, other than getting the vaccine, everything is exactly same but she passed out and I was like, I go in there. I'm Mike, is she dead? I didn't know what, I didn't know what happened. So I'm like, trying to wake her up trying to wake her up. So we take her to, you know, call the doctor, whatever, she came to got her up, did everything I needed to do and they're said, oh, she's just dehydrated. It's
Like she hadn't changed anything, she's 100% healthy, nothing to change. She hadn't liked, went on a long run. Hadn't drank and is like. So for me, that was like, you talked about, you're going to be influenced by personal experience. How am I supposed to
ignore them now? Yeah, like, if something like that happened to me, I mean, you know, it would like I, if I had known someone that had a bad effect, like this, especially a family member, a really close friend, it would have, I would have thought, otherwise it would have are
Much influence and I probably would have been looking more for in looking. At the data, I probably would have been looking at it through a different lens than I was. I was looking at it through a different
lens. I think I'd completely understand because everybody was and was hard, it's the information age more than it's ever been. You can find whatever you're looking for. So if you want to believe this one thing you will find that. Yeah. And it's
Just like this was such a god, such a de fight divisive issue. But you know, for for anybody listening to this, and I'll listen to any, you talk ever. They know how genuine you are. I mean, come on, it's like yeah. You at that one time, you felt this way. Now you now you feel this way who couldn't respect that, you know what I mean. So I appreciate you talking about it. I know we the goal wasn't to get into that. No. Because because, why? I'm, that's not why I'm
Fan of yours, you know? Because of some some Hot Topic issue. I'm a fan of you because got your so interesting. So, smart the way you verbalize things, the way you deliver it is. Just so, you know, appealing and easy, and make sense. So that's why you're here. I mean and I that I appreciate what you do and I'm just like glad that we can talk about it. It's like,
I really appreciate it to. I've had a really fantastic time these last two days. I mean, yes, it was awesome.
Mm. And I really do like the the archery for me. I'm calling it archery and it was bow hunting. Yeah, I didn't really hunt anything so for me it's already but I know it was like very much like relaxing and like the focus. It was. Yea like I said, like meditative you know?
Yeah that's what I explained last night when we're trying to, you know, we had a bear 3D Target so it's a silhouette foam replica of a bear. It's actually a small bear but so he had that out there and like when you were, you know, going to your
Shooting process with about brand-new. But and I said, you know, I mentioned you can't be thinking about anything else in your life then doing this right now. And that's what so therapeutic about shooting
about. Well, caveat, I was thinking about how I wanted to press campaigns, but but no, you're
right. Just thinking this setting to, you know, it's a and I wish I could share moments like that with everybody because it's so powerful, but we're out there. Beautiful evening.
Evening, the sun setting to the West. We got a ridge that's teeming with deer and elk and lions up there. And the back background. We're cooking Wild game on the Traeger. John and Jenn are cooking us some Whitetail tenderloin, and we're shooting shooting arrows at and you're just doing so well. And it's such a process and you're so focused. It's like, what I look at everything to me. That's like the perfect evening. I mean, it was so that's what I live for times like that.
I kind
To get it. I'm going to say kind of because I only did it once. But like I really enjoy. I was surprised by how much I enjoyed it. Like I just didn't expect like I didn't know really
what to expect
that I think having Wayne to like the teacher, who was the herd
bull super into it and
just such a good teacher. And yeah, like he was like transferring me like some of his passion for it or something. You know what I mean? Words, I contagious. Yes, you like this. Guy loves this and like, so you're at? Yeah. And
So like having I think having that as well also it's just it's kind of contagious. Yeah, cam loves this is Wayne loves us. This is like okay let's let's experience it. Let's really try to like do it, you know. Yeah so
well and then it to end the night. Remember how well you were shooting
I was it was giving my confidence like I was hot like getting those little confidence boosters were like maybe I didn't get it right in the lung like where the lungs were supposed to be but like getting it so close. Yeah. You know it's a little shots. Yeah, couple of hours. It's like a small win weird.
I could like, first of all I was like I'm hitting the bear. Are you kidding me? Like I did right, I know it is out
there a way. So we started off and maybe a couple in the dirt may be coupled to the right but then that process and you were like such a good student doing everything. Perfect holding that pen there. Pulling hard releasing. And then in last two shots, right in the law. Yeah, it's like oh my God. It's so it's Empower. I just loved it. I,
where were those last two shots that we were doing? That was not after the I pop the
Balloon. Yeah, it was wasn't close to the lung. They're both in long. They were in the long. They're both
perfect. Oh, I didn't get that. They were in the
lung know. Yeah. Because I remember, I shot two. Yeah. Two. And there, right by your other, those raw kill shots were killed. Yes. Yeah. It was. And I think because we were powered by Whitetail tender white man, that number Licious, you know. I Jin was cooked us. I told him we're going to be out there because I said, we got, you know, big day. We got to do the mound. We got to get
Both set up, but I said in the evening want to win lace down, we're going to be out there to shoot at distance and so John said, okay Jen has a plan she's going to cook up a little bit of meat for, for Rhonda and, you know, we're talking of whatever halved Wild game. Me then that led to a discussion of what's actually wild.
Yeah, my naive. So, I actually don't know
everything, right? So shoes you'd been eating Alchemy but not of course not. Wow. So wild and so we had that the
And then we had the grizzly and then you're shooting just incredible. And I don't think it's coincidence. Thank you were like
yeah it was after. Yeah. That I started shooting
better. Right. See what do you think about that? What does the science say? Well I
definitely was refueling, I think we know that for a fact.
Yeah but I like to romanticize a little bit more and just say, oh yeah, it's because of
that creatine and the meat and the yeah
first. Yeah. And you know, Wayne likes to say this too, is that
The reason why that experience can be so empowering and then you're getting better and it's just feels as if watching an arrow flying hit, he'll say that, you know, archery's is old as mankind. It's like, we've been doing this a long time, so when you start to do it, even if you hadn't done it, it feels familiar because it's in
US. Yeah, I don't know saying
that's, you know, there'd be no data to support that but that's what I believe.
Yeah. Well, I mean,
You have it.
Well, I was like, I couldn't believe. Also, it's just like, how strong you were. I mean, I think people are going to be, they're so used to being you being smart and just like so well-spoken inarticulate, but then you were a fucking beast, also. I mean, just powering those weights up. Your arms are tone strong.
We're always a showing when I had them. Hell yeah. Hell
yeah. No, it was. It's going to be probably, I don't know what you shared so much.
On social but probably not stuff like this. Have you? Hmm. No.
And we jump rope to remember,
of course I do. Yeah. You're out there. Jumping rope. We got that. It's like, you know, people are going to see a whole new side of dr. Rhonda
pack it was a fun time. I appreciate you you hosting. And in any given me that experience cam I would I never would have done any of that, you know. Yeah. Lifting the 30-foot was at 35 35. Like I've ever would have done that, there's no personal trainer that would have.
Yeah, I've done that. For sure is but like, yeah, sure. That I would have thought them out,
right? Right. Or be in this, I think it's also, it's what I've seen this many times but it's the but it's the overall, like, I'm going into this and I know it's going to be challenging because of, you know, either you see what I do. And you're like, okay, so then you're in a different place than when you normally go to a gym. You're like this is a big day. I got to be you know, I'm going to have
Do more than I've ever done. So people come in with that attitude and it, it's a self-fulfilling prophecy
II, you know, totally like that, that's my personality type for
sure. Well and so it came to fruition, it happened, you are stronger than you've ever been. You got up a mountain in the heat of the day.
Well I mean I was doing that because I was here with you. So I mean it is very like
motivating and I got up on the monument is like how beautiful was that, man? That was awesome. Yeah,
that was awesome. I'm so impressed.
Is that you were on that and that's, it's really it's really a lot. Like it's very inspiring to like, I follow your Instagram and all your your, you know, in training that you do all the different types of training, like you post a lot of running, but you do like the weight, the weight training and stuff. And like, I'm just like, he's just like I'm sitting here going, how am I going to like work out for 20 minutes and look at this guy like he's like oh, you did it baby, you know. So
what would you, what's your thoughts on Hunting? I never knew, you know, have you been around?
I didn't before and now is it different? Did you really? I mean anything
you know so I think thinking so I've never really been around hunting like I eat meat so for me it's not like I know the meat comes from an animal that is no longer
alive. You look at it more of like what's this meat offering my body? I did write
like nutritionally. And so that, that's definitely more how I look at it. So it's a very different perspective. I
I like being able to like go and you're the one providing for your family and sharing with others. I mean Jen and John were talking about sharing with like people that are in need. Like that was really. That's incredibly. That's sort of. That's incredible, right? I go and buy meat from like the farmers market or the merger restore instacart as most people do. Yeah. So it's a very removed from that that whole process, right? And I don't know that I can speak to it, like I saw
Your video with the with the bear. And yeah, but like, I don't without experiencing it. Like I, there's no way I could understand what it's like to kill an animal. Yeah. And then to provide for your family, right? Because it's not like, I'm not. I'm indirectly responsible for that, you know that animal dying because I'm buying me and there's a bam demand for that meat, right? Like, I'm eating it because I it's beneficial like it's a very high quality source of protein. It's got
High quality Iron that's bioavailable and seeing can be vitamins and I'm not sedentary and unhealthy. So it's, you know, it's not like a bad thing for me. So it's not, you know, it's not like I don't eat the meat, right. So what, why would I have a problem with hunting? Yeah, you know, but it is it's am interested in it because now like doing the whole, the, the archery experience with the compound bow in. Like, like I get school, I see.
You know it was like fun doing it and also like therapeutic where it was, you know, so you practice this thing and then you go and you use that amazing skill that you practice to like provide for your family. Yeah and so like again I can't relate but I'm like trying to put it together. You know what I mean? Yeah so I mean I appreciate people that give me and my family. Meet course well
Hunters love to do it. And that how he's in the show like this.
This with your brand new bow, because you're kidding. Yeah, yeah. So this is your bow, but this, you are the ultimate outlier and with outliers get their own equipment. So, my gosh. Yeah. You didn't know, you got to take this.
I had no idea.
I'll send it to you because your bags already full. But no, this is yours, everything. All their own arrows.
Yeah. And they're really my practice.
That's so cool. So you have your, an Archer
You have your own
bow. That is a this yes because I know what to do. Like this is yeah what about the release thing?
Yeah that everything. Okay, everything everything whatever you need you're an Archer now and that's how I'm going to show that your bow. Thank you so much for coming all the way here to Springfield Oregon. It's, you know, I never anticipated to get somebody of your stature to come here and I could share my life with you is like, I mean, I mean so much to me. Rhonda, thank you very much.
Oh, thank you. Thank
You like I can't thank you enough. Like it's been a great experience and now I get it's like I had no idea, I get so like practice this and like like I'm excited to share it with so have to get like we'll have to figure out where my husband get one of these because yeah, yeah. Wayne was telling me of some places where we can shoot in San
Diego. Yeah, Performance Archery, right. Yeah, Bob from shop. He's the best awesome, you know, him and Wayne are from the same
cloth. Okay, well I want to say thank you then. Come give you a big hug, so
All right. Thank you. Thanks loopholed. Optics has been providing my binoculars and I wear for the last few years, I like that. It's an Oregon company and they make such high quality glass is all I've really used. And if you can't find what you're hunting, it's going to be tough to kill. So, loopholed Optics has really played an integral part, and My Success. He's last few years. Thank you, loopholed for supporting the podcast. It's time to gear up for summer, at Bass Pro Shops, and Cabela's.
Time for trips to the lake stories around the campfire and memories with friends and family. Shot Bass Pro Shops and Cabela's for everything. You need to enjoy your summer, save on top brands, like I send clothing and camping gear, and Johnny Morris rods and reels, and don't forget great products, like Cabela's polar cap coolers and Pro Series. Grills Bass, Pro Shops, and Cabela's. Your Adventure Starts Here, shop in store or online
